Date: Wed, 17 Mar 93 18:24:20 -0700
Message-Id: <2ba683c1.tillage@tillage.DIALix.oz.au>
Errors-To: roper@csf.Colorado.EDU
Reply-To: gil@tillage.DIALix.oz.au
Originator: wsn@csf.colorado.edu
Sender: wsn@csf.Colorado.EDU
Precedence: bulk
From: "Gil Hardwick" <gil@tillage.DIALix.oz.au>
To: chriscd@jhuvm.hcf.jhu.edu
Subject:   Re: wagar and the future
 
On Mon, 15 Mar 93 20:03:32 -0700, "CHRIS CHASE-DUNN" <CHRISCD@JHUVM.HCF.JHU.EDU>
 wrote:
> The socialism of the future will be different than the socialism of
> the past and it will examine why the experiments went wrong and what went
> right. the current funk will pass with the ideological hegemony of
> neo-liberalism. New forms of organization will emerge and old forms will
> be revitalized. there will be new socialist revolutions in the semiperiphery
> and new labor movements and socialist parties everywhere. They may not use
> the word "socialist." But they will try to make a more cooperative and
> collectively rational world.
> My question about wagar is this. how can we do RED EARTH without having to
> go through 2044?
>       chris chase-dunn   chriscd@jhuvm.hcf.jhu.edu
 
I see now precisely where we differ. You propose *new* "socialist"
forms of organisation arising in the future, where I (and Danial Foss
I understand) point out to you repeatedly that there is nothing new
about such forms of social organisation at all; they are traditional
community structures based on kinship which date from the dawning of
the very first day.
 
The social-structural dynamic at force here is not between Capitalism
and Socialism, which are two sides of the one coin minted during the
Dutch War of Independence against Spain, and then put into circulation
during the English Civil War. To whatever extent that agony has been
transported around the world, it remains a modern European agony. I
would point out to you that the Chinese have also spread across the
planet, without taking that sort of nonsense with them with which to
belabour and terrorise all and sundry.
 
If you want a reliably predictive analysis of future events, you need
to take into your account traditional European societies and cultures
which predate the modern era by many thousands of years, and also the
many other non-European societies and cultures of the world which are
currently reasserting themselves in the wake of the West's shame and
embarrassment realising the extent of its own propensity to violence.
 
I doubt your students will finally thank you, BTW, if you persist in
only giving them books to read which don't challenge their brains to
think. No wonder the academy is in such decline and disarray.
 
 
--
Gil Hardwick                             AARNet: gil@tillage.DIALix.oz.au
Consulting Ethnologist                            Phone: (+61 9) 399 2401
PERTH, Western Australia                            Fax: (+61 9) 399 4941
   * * Sustainable Community Development & Environmental Education * *